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Re: How Prosecutors Wiretap Wall Street
From: Chris <r0ck () operamail com>
Date: Thu, 5 Nov 2009 22:03:31 -0600

----- Original Message -----
From: "Paul Schmehl" <pschmehl_lists () tx rr com>
To: "full-disclosure" <full-disclosure () lists grok org uk>
Subject: Re: [Full-disclosure] How Prosecutors Wiretap Wall Street
Date: Thu, 05 Nov 2009 21:47:41 -0600

--On November 5, 2009 9:12:29 PM -0600 Chris <r0ck () operamail com> wrote:

Getting back on topic, it is well-known, and proven, that the NSA has
surveillence facilities inside  several U.S. telecom carriers.  You need
only look inside one of AT&T's PoPs in San Francisco for proof.

You know this to be true because you've looked for yourself, right?  You
didn't just take the world of a complete stranger quoted by a compliant
press at face value, did you?

The pictures were good enough.

Yes, the NSA might target non-citizens, however, without oversight, who
is to know?  Don't mention FISA judges either. They have become a rubber
stamp for wiretap requests with an approval rate of well over 99.99%.

Sure, because we all know those rat bastards at the NSA and all those
federal judges don't give a shit about the USA or freedom or personal

What do you say to the 99.99% approval rate?  Are the FBI and other enforcement agencies just that good or is there a 
rubber stamp at work here?
When you forget that the people who work in government are just like you,
trying to make a living and do the best they can, it's easy to
depersonalize them and demonize them as if they're all blackhearted evil
turds.  Easy, that is, if you don't have much of a brain.

What an idealistic view.  How quant.  I suppose you believe in truth, justice, and the American way as well.  This is 
2009.  Wake up, Paul.  The government is about one thing -- staying in existence.  Given your stance on other topics, 
I'm surprised you don't realize this.
The same applies to the NSLs issued by the FBI.  Not only are targets
not permitted to talk about such NSLs, but they can't even acknowledge
the existance of such NSLs.

And yet, here you are asking for the very proof that cannot be provided.

That's hilarious.  The surveillance program didn't even survive for four
years after 9/11 before someone inside the NSA "blew the whistle" on the
program.  (snip off-topic ranting)

We aren't talking about the NSA.  Try to keep up.  The NSLs are issued by the FBI.

And of course Congress knew nothing about it, even though they had been
briefed about it dozens of times and never raised a single objection.

No question they dropped the ball.  Am only surprised that you didn't expect as much.

(snip more off-topic diversionary BS)

Of course we all know that Joe Wilson told the truth and George Bush lied.
That should be obvious to any rational person, right?

Nobody mentioned George W Bush.  Oh wait...you did.  Why is that?

But we'll never know for sure if the "whistleblowers" were motivated by
something other than altruism, because you're so deeply concerned about
your personal privacy and freedom that it would never even occur to you to
question the motives of anyone who agrees with your view of the world.

This isn't about me, Paul.  Despite your attempt to divert the discussion.

The fact that you believe that only those who violate their oath of office
are honest and only those who never violate their oath of office are
dishonest blinds you to the possibility that the truth lies somewhere in

Wow.  How did you pull that fact out of your ass?  Nobody mentioned violating their oaths of office...except you.  more 
diversionary bullshit.

The only question I have for you is...

Which government agency is paying your mortgage?

The same one that is proposing to pay for your healthcare and control
every other aspect of your life because you're too blind to see the forest
for the trees.  

I, along with my employer, pay for my health care.  That's another thing you're wrong about.

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