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more on We're All Prisoners, Now: US Citizens to be Required ''Clearance'' to Leave USA
From: David Farber <dave () farber net>
Date: Thu, 9 Nov 2006 11:46:32 -0500

Begin forwarded message:

From: Bob Frankston <Bob2-19-0501 () bobf frankston com>
Date: November 9, 2006 11:38:35 AM EST
To: dave () farber net, ip () v2 listbox com
Subject: RE: [IP] We're All Prisoners, Now: US Citizens to be Required ''Clearance'' to Leave USA

Sounds like that Iron Curtain that Churchill spoke about. Next we’ll ban people from leaving because they have strategic knowledge?

Along these lines, I wondered why faux ATT (fATT) required I verify that I haven’t changed my location whenever there is a power hiccup – this means that in an emergency I can’t get E911 until I verify everything. It’s a perfect example of using the letter of the law completely thwart the spirit. But that’s bad enough – turns out that fATT says that the FCC mandates that you can’t have VoIP unless you’re in an area that supported E911. Hence you can’t take the phone with you when traveling.

How have we gone from the idea of meddling only when there is a clear and present danger to presuming everything is a clear and present danger? In E911 we have fATT exploiting our fears for to subvert the marketplace but then how different is that from what has been happening at all levels of government.

We’ll see if this changes with the new Congress or is fear so ingrained that those who don’t pander to it will meet their match in fear itself?

From: David Farber [mailto:dave () farber net]
Sent: Thursday, November 09, 2006 11:16
To: ip () v2 listbox com
Subject: [IP] We're All Prisoners, Now: US Citizens to be Required ''Clearance'' to Leave USA


October 26, 2006

Forget no-fly lists. If Uncle Sam gets its way, beginning on Jan. 14,

2007, we'll all be on no-fly lists, unless the government gives us

permission to leave-or re-enter-the United States.

The U.S. Department of Homeland Security (HSA) has proposed that all

airlines, cruise lines-even fishing boats-be required to obtain

clearance for each passenger they propose taking into or out of the

United States.

It doesn't matter if you have a U.S. Passport - a "travel document"

that now, absent a court order to the contrary, gives you a virtually

unqualified right to enter or leave the United States, any time you

want. When the DHS system comes into effect next January, if the

agency says "no" to a clearance request, or doesn't answer the

request at all, you won't be permitted to enter-or leave-the United


Consider what might happen if you're a U.S. passport holder on

assignment in a country like Saudi Arabia. Your visa is about to

expire, so you board your flight back to the United States. But wait!

You can't get on, because you don't have permission from the HSA.

Saudi immigration officials are on hand to escort you to a squalid

detention center, where you and others who are now effectively

"stateless persons" are detained, potentially indefinitely, until

their immigration status is sorted out.

Why might the HSA deny you permission to leave-or enter-the United

States? No one knows, because the entire clearance procedure would be

an administrative determination made secretly, with no right of

appeal. Naturally, the decision would be made without a warrant,

without probable cause and without even any particular degree of

suspicion. Basically, if the HSA decides it doesn't like you, you're

a prisoner - either outside, or inside, the United States, whether or

not you hold a U.S. passport.

The U.S. Supreme Court has long recognized there is a constitutional

right to travel internationally. Indeed, it has declared that the

right to travel is "a virtually unconditional personal right." The

United States has also signed treaties guaranteeing "freedom of

travel." So if these regulations do go into effect, you can expect a

lengthy court battle, both nationally and internationally.

Think this can't happen? Think again. It's ALREADY happening. Earlier

this year, HSA forbade airlines from transporting an 18-year-old a

native-born U.S. citizen, back to the United States. The prohibition

lasted nearly six months until it was finally lifted a few weeks ago.

Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union are two countries in recent history

that didn't allow their citizens to travel abroad without permission.

If these regulations go into effect, you can add the United States to

this list.

For more information on this proposed regulation, see http://


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