Re: ASN "Hijacked"

[Mike via NANOG <nanog () lists nanog org>]

Matt,

    Excellent application of Hanlon's Razor - "Never attribute to 
malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity"

    Wish more ops could learn to embrace same.

    $0.02

Mike

On 9/14/26 07:28, Matt Brennan via NANOG wrote:
> I'm not willing to say that it's intentional, or malicious, as I don't have
> the evidence to back that up.
>
> However, considering the same thing is happening to at least 2 different
> ASNs, and when they fixed mine it didn't fix the other ... IMO the best
> case scenario is that it's an inexperienced network engineer making a lot
> of mistakes.
>
> As I review the list of peers they have, there are several which don't make
> obvious sense for a Brazilian telecom company. I'm betting it's more than
> 2, and the others just haven't realized it yet.
>
> -Matt
>
>
> On Sat, 12 Sept 2026 at 18:36, Dan Mahoney <danm () prime gushi org> wrote:
>
> > Any chance this was a digit-flip from an existing legit peer?  It happens
> > to the best of us.
> >
> > -Dan
> >
> > > On Sep 12, 2026, at 3:32 PM, Matt Brennan via NANOG <
> > nanog () lists nanog org> wrote:
> > > Hi Folks,
> > >
> > >   After filing abuse tickets with a few of their upstreams, I received an
> > > email today (from a different contact than the abuse contact) apologizing
> > > and telling me the issue has been resolved. I am not seeing my ASN in
> > their
> > > peering anymore, so it does appear to be resolved.
> > >
> > >   Ryan -- I still see yours in their list. If you want the email address
> > of
> > > who apologized to me let me know and I'll provide it off-list.
> > >
> > >   Thanks again, everyone, for the advice.
> > >
> > > -Matt
> > >
> > > On Fri, 11 Sept 2026 at 17:51, Bryton Herdes <bryton () cloudflare com>
> > wrote:
> > > > Hey Matt -
> > > >
> > > > We're not receiving those routes from them over peering, and it looks
> > like
> > > > they're not propagating widely to their upstreams or peers.
> > > > I checked today's RIB dumps, and see the routes in RouteViews (amsix,
> > > > ix-br.gru, saopaulo), only with paths "271253 27421" and "1000 27421"
> > from
> > > > their own peer IPs toward the collectors. I'm not sure what they (or
> > > > someone else) have done, but maybe they're just sharing these routes
> > with
> > > > collectors (fingers crossed!).
> > > >
> > > > I'll send you the dumps I grabbed separately via email, and can give
> > you a
> > > > couple of LINK contacts if you don't already have them.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Bryton Herdes
> > > > Principal Network Engineer
> > > > AS13335 - Cloudflare
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Fri, Sep 11, 2026 at 3:24 PM Matt Brennan <brennanma () gmail com>
> > wrote:
> > > > > Thanks, everyone, for the feedback. FYI we do have ROA set up for our
> > > > > prefixes, and I set up ASPA earlier this week hoping it might help
> > this ...
> > > > > situation.
> > > > >
> > > > > After reviewing Ryan's note, I reviewed the list of their peers further
> > > > > and I feel like a number of them are likely hijacked. I have now
> > reached
> > > > > out to who I am confident are upstreams of them (HE, Cogent, Level3)
> > and
> > > > > we'll see where that gets me. Of course, with more than 5,000 alleged
> > peers
> > > > > this could easily be a zero sum game.
> > > > >
> > > > > @Bryton -- as a note, both of the upstream ASs are peering with you as
> > > > > well, but your abuse form doesn't really have an option for this type
> > of
> > > > > submission.
> > > > >
> > > > > -Matt
> > > > >
> > > > > On Fri, 11 Sept 2026 at 16:06, Bryton Herdes via NANOG <
> > > > > nanog () lists nanog org> wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > > > b) resolve AS-SET into an ASN tree
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > c) prune from the tree ASPA violating branches
> > > > > > I've discussed this with a few people with the same ideas, and I can
> > > > > > think
> > > > > > of few reasons not to ship it as long as it's done right.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > It is appealing to get some value from the ASPAs as early as possible,
> > > > > > and
> > > > > > pruning bad members from an expanded AS-SET tree could offer that.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > --
> > > > > > Bryton Herdes
> > > > > > Principal Network Engineer
> > > > > > AS13335 - Cloudflare
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Fri, Sep 11, 2026 at 11:58 AM Saku Ytti via NANOG <
> > > > > > nanog () lists nanog org>
> > > > > > wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > On Fri, 11 Sept 2026 at 18:04, Christopher Hawker via NANOG
> > > > > > > <nanog () lists nanog org> wrote:
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > I would look at creating ASPAs objects with $rir in the first
> > > > > > instance.
> > > > > > > Would help combat these sorts of issues :)
> > > > > > > > Ask your upstream to create objects, then ask them to ask their
> > > > > > > upstreams, and so on… You get the picture.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > If someone feels like vibing, may I suggest.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > a) recover AS-SET <-> ASN relation
> > > > > > >     - look at RIR data, check if (mp-)export has exactly one AS-SET ->
> > > > > > > match
> > > > > > >     - look at peeringDB
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > b) resolve AS-SET into an ASN tree
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > c) prune from the tree ASPA violating branches
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > d) return prefix-list, and origin ASN list
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > This way anyone already doing RIR prefix-list generation, without any
> > > > > > > ASPA support in NOS, could get a significant amount of ASPA benefits
> > > > > > > without changing anything in the NOS side, just changing command they
> > > > > > > call to translate customer AS-SET into prefix-list or AS origin list
> > > > > > > or both.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > --
> > > > > > >   ++ytti
> > > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > > NANOG mailing list
> > https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/nanog () lists nanog org/message/UOBGN4KMIREKINGTIAQ4K2ZKC62FPOUE/
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > NANOG mailing list
> > https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/nanog () lists nanog org/message/2FQHH6LNCO3QKUUBBWT6RA77OXJOKNYN/
> > > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > NANOG mailing list
> > https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/nanog () lists nanog org/message/JPZJACIKN5YVICMTCRHOCAJT4APYOVE5/
> _______________________________________________
> NANOG mailing list
> https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/nanog () lists nanog org/message/QJLNDLFHZRDHEBLMEIUJCIA7NQHAK6I7/
_______________________________________________
NANOG mailing list 
https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/nanog () lists nanog org/message/EVLGTUI5AI6OASE424O7IHTAIPVOVHUU/