RE: Route optimization using GPUs?

[Drew Weaver <drew.weaver () thenap com>]

To be fair it’s a technology and how it’s implemented does make a difference.

Wouldn’t you agree?

From: NANOG <nanog-bounces+drew.weaver=thenap.com () nanog org> On Behalf Of Tom Beecher
Sent: Thursday, December 5, 2024 3:40 PM
To: Mike Hammett <nanog () ics-il net>
Cc: nanog () nanog org
Subject: Re: Route optimization using GPUs?

I think most of the hatred towards them is unwarranted,

This is essentially saying "I've never had a problem , so I don't think it's a big deal."

On Thu, Dec 5, 2024 at 3:19 PM Mike Hammett <nanog () ics-il net<mailto:nanog () ics-il net>> wrote:
Eh, different people have different opinions.

I think most of the hatred towards them is unwarranted,


-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.ics-2Dil.com&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=OPufM5oSy-PFpzfoijO_w76wskMALE1o4LtA3tMGmuw&m=05VYBsDnfxCJ7Vxr7z0MIQ9mIlNuADBqxVE2HDtJGzq5iJ-9eBv_7Jlhc5rqpFTg&s=NLianZlO4ViwCYophTrfZE50uZKYa8yssLj8lsq3pEM&e=>

Midwest-IX
http://www.midwest-ix.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=http-3A__www.midwest-2Dix.com&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=OPufM5oSy-PFpzfoijO_w76wskMALE1o4LtA3tMGmuw&m=05VYBsDnfxCJ7Vxr7z0MIQ9mIlNuADBqxVE2HDtJGzq5iJ-9eBv_7Jlhc5rqpFTg&s=HpRDI05R4hN7UhPogwyTylvAWP-tGCZNBJAiM-a-8Os&e=>

________________________________
From: "Rich Compton" <RICH_COMPTON () comcast com<mailto:RICH_COMPTON () comcast com>>
To: "Mike Hammett" <nanog () ics-il net<mailto:nanog () ics-il net>>, "Jason Bothe" <jbothe () me com<mailto:jbothe () 
me com>>
Cc: nanog () nanog org<mailto:nanog () nanog org>
Sent: Thursday, December 5, 2024 2:10:47 PM
Subject: Re: Route optimization using GPUs?
“I strongly recommend to turn off those BGP optimizers, glue the ports shut, burn the hardware, and salt the grounds on 
which the BGP optimizer sales people walked.”

-Job Snijders

https://mailman.nanog.org/pipermail/nanog/2017-August/092131.html<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__mailman.nanog.org_pipermail_nanog_2017-2DAugust_092131.html&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=OPufM5oSy-PFpzfoijO_w76wskMALE1o4LtA3tMGmuw&m=05VYBsDnfxCJ7Vxr7z0MIQ9mIlNuADBqxVE2HDtJGzq5iJ-9eBv_7Jlhc5rqpFTg&s=JlxUbpyZ5QY4KO6fooZ_v2dzXdWoJwMFmTQjl87JQ6M&e=>


From: NANOG <nanog-bounces+rich_compton=comcast.com () nanog org<mailto:comcast.com () nanog org>> on behalf of Mike 
Hammett <nanog () ics-il net<mailto:nanog () ics-il net>>
Date: Thursday, December 5, 2024 at 12:24 PM
To: Jason Bothe <jbothe () me com<mailto:jbothe () me com>>
Cc: nanog () nanog org<mailto:nanog () nanog org> <nanog () nanog org<mailto:nanog () nanog org>>
Subject: Re: Route optimization using GPUs?
IIRC, the widespread outages are the result of exporting things that shouldn't be exported.


-----
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__urldefense.com_v3_-5F-5Fhttp-3A_www.ics-2Dil.com-5F-5F-3B-21-21CQl3mcHX2A-21GFUnuA6qE7A0AePY8rTtMX8Ll2VP7FK-2DFJTDkvkdwhlRmzqhmEA7Dat58fBwUk9jdLbHKhdSYEBil7VttQ-24&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=OPufM5oSy-PFpzfoijO_w76wskMALE1o4LtA3tMGmuw&m=05VYBsDnfxCJ7Vxr7z0MIQ9mIlNuADBqxVE2HDtJGzq5iJ-9eBv_7Jlhc5rqpFTg&s=HwztAxdPZtfgn_s2jg1HMBFPZjPmDJ9psIPNuNJK-i4&e=>

Midwest-IX
http://www.midwest-ix.com<https://urldefense.proofpoint.com/v2/url?u=https-3A__urldefense.com_v3_-5F-5Fhttp-3A_www.midwest-2Dix.com-5F-5F-3B-21-21CQl3mcHX2A-21GFUnuA6qE7A0AePY8rTtMX8Ll2VP7FK-2DFJTDkvkdwhlRmzqhmEA7Dat58fBwUk9jdLbHKhdSYEAsGopkmw-24&d=DwMFaQ&c=euGZstcaTDllvimEN8b7jXrwqOf-v5A_CdpgnVfiiMM&r=OPufM5oSy-PFpzfoijO_w76wskMALE1o4LtA3tMGmuw&m=05VYBsDnfxCJ7Vxr7z0MIQ9mIlNuADBqxVE2HDtJGzq5iJ-9eBv_7Jlhc5rqpFTg&s=-IO7Injcjd7v8SWcsxC6eLHhq73be7HAPidnwY5y_Xo&e=>

________________________________
From: "Jason Bothe via NANOG" <nanog () nanog org<mailto:nanog () nanog org>>
To: "Drew Weaver" <drew.weaver () thenap com<mailto:drew.weaver () thenap com>>
Cc: nanog () nanog org<mailto:nanog () nanog org>
Sent: Thursday, December 5, 2024 11:03:39 AM
Subject: Re: Route optimization using GPUs?

WIth merchant silicon getting faster and stronger everyday, and capacity and transit in a freewill, I’m not sure what 
GPU optimization would buy you, not to mention the ROI. The Internet routing table is not showing substantial signs of 
growth and in some cases has experienced a plateau. Also, the experience with ‘route optimization tools’ is that while 
they may bring you some priority in your traffic, they are also known for making horrible decisions resulting in 
widespread outages.

J~


On Dec 5, 2024, at 8:13 AM, Drew Weaver <drew.weaver () thenap com<mailto:drew.weaver () thenap com>> wrote:

So back in the.. hell I don’t know like… early 2010s there was a push for ‘route optimization’ from products like 
RouteScience and the Avaya CNA and more recently whatever Noction is doing.

The big pain point for this technology at the time was that it could only optimize the top N egress routes due to how 
many probes it could send out and how many results it could process.

It seems like now with a modest GPU in a router you could pretty easily ‘optimize’ [to the extent that you believe this 
technology worked] pretty much the whole routing table.

We used these tools extensively back then and they actually worked pretty well in most cases. The biggest issue we ran 
into was people complaining that we pinged their IP addresses… which now a days seems like a great worst problem to 
have.

Anyway is anyone doing any work on implementing GPUs into the BGP decision making process? Seems like a no brainer.

-Drew